With my American friend: 1
(Poetry & Religion)
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Hi Abdullah, sorry to be so
tardy in response to your message from some time back on poetry.
Abdullah
"ýThank you again for your messages. I was so surprised to read your ýýwonderful reading in an Arabic poem. I really feel that you became an Arabic ýýperson, you just need, a she-camel or a “Nagah ýý”, in Arabic, ýýinstead of a car! I have read your critical essay about Ka’b ibn Zuhayr’s ode ýý“Su’ād Has Departed”, or “Banat Su’ād" ýþý and I enjoy it so much.
Chris
::blush:: Thank you! I'm really flattered. : )
Abdullah
ý1) You said, “In Arabic poetry, a poem rarely sets out to describe or ýýimitate anything, as Western poetry often does; instead, a poem criticizes, ýýpraises, mocks, pleads, >apologizes, bargains, and otherwise accomplishes ýýmore concrete goals than Shakespeare’s Sonnets.”
This judgement is not ýýprecisely correct. First of all, you study a >specific text, which belongs to the ýýSeventh Century, and the Arabic poetry has developed very widely from that ýýtime until now. Moreover, even in the pre-Islamic poetry the most of ýýQasidas was a description of the desert, animals, trees, sky and stars, ýýatmosphere, and every aspect of the nature and life. However, we need a ýývery deep knowledge about the Arab’s mythological patterns to understand ýýtheir poetry then to analyze it. As for the last section of the pre-Islamic poem, ýýI think it was traditionally the ! part which the poet usually adds latter for some ýýpersonal or social purposes, such as to criticizes, praises, mocks, pleads, ýýapologizes, bargains, etc. For this reason, there were many poems which ýýdid not include this section, at all.ý
Chris
Hmmm, that's interesting. Professor Stetkevych emphasized throughout the class that Arabic odes ALWAYS do more than describe. Maybe this is an interpretation that the two of you disagree on? In any case, I was not aware of these poems you speak of when I wrote my paper, so I regurgitated the same information she fed to me in class. What I understood her to mean was this: odes are full of lots of descriptive sentences, such as making a simile from the camel to an oryx bull. However, the reason a poet PRODUCES his work always has to do with a political (e.g., denouncing a king) or social (e.g., praising his tribe) interactive value. By contrast, many English poets simply search for beauty or a way to express themselves--the interactive motives are submerged beneath more prominent motives of expression. Do you know of some poems online that I could read that exemplify your point? Because, of course, I am no expert, and you and Prof. Stetkevych are, so I must look to you two for direction in what poems are good.
Abdullah
Yes, professor Stetkevych is right, “Arabic odes ALWAYS do more than describe”, nay, every poem in the world must say more than what its words usually say, otherwise it will not be a poem any more. However, the main point which I really disagree with professor Stetkevych on is that she interprets the pre-Islamic poetry depending on several mythological patterns from the world, except the Arabic mythology! When we compare the pre-Islamic poetry with its contemporary culture, I mean with the pre-Islamic culture, we can see the oryx bull, for example, as a symbol to the moon and the addax as a symbol to the sun. The reason was that some Arabs have been hallowing the Moon while the others have been hallowing the Sun, then they believe in some sacred animals as symbols to the Sun-god or Moon-god. The holy Quran referred to this when it says:
“37. Among His Sings are the Night and the Day, and the Sun and the Moon. Adore not the sun and the moon, but adore Allah, Who created them, if it is Him ye wish to serve.
38. But is the (Unbelievers) are arrogant, (no matter): for in the presence of thy Lord are those who celebrate His praises by night and by day. And they never flag (nor feel themselves above it).”
This is a very long story, however! Therefore, our interpretation will be beyond of any political or social or even aesthetical value. I could say the Jahely poetry resembles the old Greek poetry.
Be careful, by the way, we can not say that Ka’b “wrote the poem", as you say. Maybe he wrote it or not, but most of pre-Islamic poets were oral poets, so they often say, or sing, their poems. And this point is very important in how to understand their poetry.
ýOn the other hand, we can not say, “Ibn Zuhayr” to indicate to “Ka’b ibn Zuhayr.” ýýBecause “Ibn Zuhayr” means “The son of Zuhayr ibn Aby Sulma”, and ýýZuhayr ibn Aby Sulma was a poet who has two sons, Ka’b and Bujayr, and ýýthe both were poets. So, you should say ka’b or Ka’b ibn Zuhayr. ý
Chris
Oops. I was chastised in
class, as well, for doing this.
Abdullah
I can say that Su’ād was a symbol of the new religion, Islam. I think ýýKa’b tried to express his long researching for Su’ād, or for his dream of ýýhappiness, but he didn’t >find it in the pre-Islamic society, therefore he ýýattended to Mohammed to be a Muslim, to find his dream of real happiness, ýýto reach to his lover Su’ād.
Chris
I agree. As I went back over the poem at the end of my course, I became more positive of this. At first I was not sure whether Su’ād referred to a happiness external to Islam which was satisfied by finding Islam, or whether Islam and happiness were synonymous in Su’ād. I now believe the latter, since Ka'b ibn Zuhayr had changed to a devout Muslim by the time he wrote the poem.
Abdullah
ýYou did say, “His merging of Islamic ideals with pre-Islamic ýýpoetic traditions is complete when he says, “The spear does not pierce them ýýexcept in the throat, / Nor do they shrink from death’s water troughs.” Using ýýa classical non-Islamic axiom, Ka’b implies that it is God and the religion ýýwhich he has been praising that leads the Qurashis to the honorable position ýýthey have achieved.” You may know that Islam religion is different of either ýýChristianity or Jewish religion. Christianity is an ideal religion, as I think, ýýwhile Jewish religion is a material religion, but Islam is a middle religion ýýbetween Christianity and Jewish religion. Islam doesn’t say for example, “If ýýsomeone strike you on your right cheek, turn to him the other also”, as the ýýChristian concept. It’s true that Islam means “the peace”, and it is, of course, ýýan ideal religion, but in the same time Islam believes in a necessity of strong ýýpower in the life.
Chris
Ah! I was not aware of that, but what you say makes sense. I had only heard Islam described in terms of its historical progression, that Muslims see it as a "cleansing" of Christianity. As an aside, I believe that Mormons hold a similar view to what I saw expressed in the video about Islam, namely the belief that religions start out pure but over time decay and become corrupt...and the societies that were buoyed by these religions sink as well. But back to what you said, the view of Islam as being in between Christianity and Judaism clarifies a lot for me. Thank you!
Abdullah
Yes, Muslims see Islam as a cleansing of Christianity. Every new religion sees like that, in deed. But in the same time Muslims believe that Jesus was a great messenger, as well as Moses and all of the God’s prophets and messengers. Otherwise we will not be Muslims if we don’t believe in this. In the holy Quran (Surah 3, Al-Imran) we read:
“78. There is among them a section who distort the Book with their tongues: (As they read) you would think it is a part of the Book, but it is no part of the Book; and they say, "That is from Allah," but it is not from Allah. It is they who tell a lie against Allah, and (well) they know it!
79. It is not (possible) that a man, to whom is given the Book, and Wisdom, and the prophetic office, should say to people: "Be ye my worshippers rather than Allah.s": on the contrary (He would say) "Be ye worshippers of Him Who is truly the Cherisher of all: For ye have taught the Book and ye have studied it earnestly."
80. Nor would he instruct you to take angels and prophets for Lords and patrons. What! would he bid you to unbelief after ye have bowed your will (To Allah in Islam)?
81. Behold! Allah took the covenant of the prophets, saying: "I give you a Book and Wisdom; then comes to you an apostle, confirming what is with you; do ye believe in him and render him help." Allah said: "Do ye agree, and take this my Covenant as binding on you?" They said: "We agree." He said: "Then bear witness, and I am with you among the witnesses."
82. If any turn back after this, they are perverted transgressors.
83. Do they seek for other than the Religion of Allah.-while all creatures in the heavens and on earth have, willing or unwilling, bowed to His Will (Accepted Islam), and to Him shall they all be brought back.
84. Say: "We believe in Allah, and in what has been revealed to us and what was revealed to Abraham, Isma'il, Isaac, Jacob, and the Tribes, and in (the Books) given to Moses, Jesus, and the prophets, from their Lord: We make no distinction between one and another among them, and to Allah do we bow our will (in Islam)."
85. If anyone desires a religion other than Islam (submission to Allah, never will it be accepted of him; and in the Hereafter He will be in the ranks of those who have lost (All spiritual good).
86. How shall Allah Guide those who reject Faith after they accepted it and bore witness that the Messenger was true and that Clear Signs had come unto them? but Allah guides not a people unjust.
87. Of such the reward is that on them (rests) the curse of Allah, of His angels, and of all mankind;-
88. In that will they dwell; nor will their penalty be lightened, nor respite be (their lot);-
89. Except for those that repent (Even) after that, and make amends; for verily Allah is Oft-Forgiving, Most Merciful.
90. But those who reject Faith after they accepted it, and then go on adding to their defiance of Faith,- never will their repentance be accepted; for they are those who have (of set purpose) gone astray.
91. As to those who reject Faith, and die rejecting,- never would be accepted from any such as much gold as the earth contains, though they should offer it for ransom. For such is (in store) a penalty grievous, and they will find no helpers.”
The main difference between Islam and Christianity is this: We don’t believe that Jesus is the son of the God, because the God is the God, he is only one, he doesn’t need to any one else to help, no wife, no son, and no father or mother. In the
noble Quran we read:
“Say (O Muhammad): “He is Allah, (the) one. Allah-us-Samad [Allah the Self-Sufficient Master, Whom all creatures need, (He neither eats nor drinks)]. He begets not, nor was He begotten. And there is none co-equal or comparable unto Him.” (Surah 112, Al-Ikhlas (The Purity)).
In Surah 19, Maryam (Mary):
“16. Relate in the Book (the story of) Mary, when she withdrew from her family to a place in the East.
17. She placed a screen (to
screen herself) from them; then We sent her our angel, and he appeared before her as a man in all respects.
18. She said: "I seek refuge
from thee to ((Allah)) Most Gracious: (come not near) if thou dost fear Allah."
19. He said: "Nay, I am only a messenger from thy Lord, (to announce) to thee the gift of a holy son.
20. She said: "How shall I have a son, seeing that no man has touched me, and I am not unchaste?"
21. He said: "So (it will be): Thy Lord saith, 'that is easy for Me: and (We wish) to appoint him as a Sign unto men and a Mercy from Us':It is a matter (so) decreed."
22. So she conceived him, and she retired with him to a remote place.
23. And the pains of childbirth drove her to the trunk of a palm-tree: She cried (in her anguish): "Ah! would that I had died before this! would that I had been a thing forgotten and out of sight!"
24. But (a voice) cried to her from beneath the (palm-tree): "Grieve not! for thy Lord hath provided a rivulet beneath thee;
25. "And shake towards thyself the trunk of the palm-tree: It will let fall fresh ripe dates upon thee.
26. "So eat and drink and cool (thine) eye. And if thou dost see any man, say, 'I have vowed a fast to ((Allah)) Most Gracious, and this day will I enter into not talk with any human being'"
27. At length she brought the (babe) to her people, carrying him (in her arms). They said: "O Mary! truly an amazing thing hast thou brought!
28. "O sister of Aaron! Thy father was not a man of evil, nor thy mother a woman unchaste!"
29. But she pointed to the babe. They said: "How can we talk to one who is a child in the cradle?"
30. He said: "I am indeed a servant of Allah. He hath given me revelation and made me a prophet;
31. "And He hath made me blessed wheresoever I be, and hath enjoined on me Prayer and Charity as long as I live;
32. "(He) hath made me kind to my mother, and not overbearing or miserable;
33. "So peace is on me the day I was born, the day that I die, and the day that I shall be raised up to life (again)"!
34. Such (was) Jesus the son of Mary: (it is) a statement of truth, about which they (vainly) dispute.
35. It is not befitting to (the majesty of) Allah that He should beget a son. Glory be to Him! when He determines a matter, He only says to it, "Be", and it is.
36. Verily Allah is my Lord and your Lord: Him therefore serve ye: this is a Way that is straight.
37. But the sects differ among themselves: and woe to the unbelievers because of the (coming) Judgment of a Momentous Day!
38. How plainly will they see and hear, the Day that they will appear before Us! but the unjust today are in error manifest!
39. But warn them of the Day of Distress, when the matter will be determined: for (behold,) they are negligent and they do not believe!
40. It is We Who will inherit the earth, and all beings thereon: to Us will they all be returned.”
This is the God and this is Jesus in the Islamic religion. So, Muslims believe there were two levels of Christianity, the original one, and Muslims must believe it was a true religion, then the traditional Christianity, which over time decayed and became corrupt, especially the Christians’ belief that Jesus was the son of the God.
If you have questions about Islam, I would direct you to visit this web-site
“http://islamonline.com/”
or this one:
“http://www.islam.com/”.
As for your question about Jihad, you can visit this site:
"http://www.al-madeena.com/ebad.html#Jihad.
It doesn’t mean that all
Muslims can agree or disagree with what mentioned in these sites, but this is just to give you some background, you may be wish to discuss me about in the future.
You did asked me also this question: “Would you mind telling me which part of the Qu'ran this citation (The citation about the love between Muslims and Christians) comes from? I would like to share it, or hang it up somewhere, to clarify that there should be no enmity between Christians and Muslims.”
That is in (Surah 5 Al-Maidah (The Table, The Table Spread), part 6, Ayah 82-86):
“82. Strongest among men in enmity to the believers wilt thou find the Jews and Pagans; and nearest among them in love to the believers wilt thou find those who say, "We are Christians": because amongst these are men devoted to learning and men who have renounced the world, and they are not arrogant.
83. And when they listen to the revelation received by the Messenger, thou wilt see their eyes overflowing with tears, for they recognise the truth: they pray: "Our Lord! we believe; write us down among the witnesses.
84. "What cause can we have not to believe in Allah and the truth which has come to us, seeing that we long for our Lord to admit us to the company of the righteous?"
85. And for this their prayer hath Allah rewarded them with gardens, with rivers flowing underneath,- their eternal home. Such is the recompense of those who do good.
86. But those who reject Faith and belie our Signs,- they shall be companions of Hell-fire. “
To share us in this open dialogue, feel free to send your respoonse on this e-mail Address
p.alfaify@gmail.com
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